My TS185 isn't smoking as much as it used to, how do I check the oil pump?
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  1. #1
    Where Am I ?
    My Bike(s)
    1975 Suzuki TS185
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    Denver, CO
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    38

    My TS185 isn't smoking as much as it used to, how do I check the oil pump?

    Hey everyone!

    So I noticed the other day that my bike isn't smoking as much as it used to and I'm super worried that the injection system isn't working and no oil is getting to the engine. I want to check this asap, but I'm not sure how to do it without ruining any parts!

    I've looked everywhere online but everyone shows how to check an oil pump AFTER it's taken out of the bike... but this is where I'm confused. Here's how it connects to the engine (the dark brown clear looking tube):

    https://imgur.com/CCmNavj

    Do you think I can just pull that tube out? Then just push it back in when I'm done testing the system?
    Last edited by diericx; 10-30-2018 at 08:03 PM.

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  3. #2
    Seat Tester
    My Bike(s)
    2002 VS800
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    Arizona Territory
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    Didn't you just get a new, used exhaust off eBay ? If you've installed it, that could account for less smoke. Previous straight pipe vs new,used exhaust with baffle plates.
    Riding Ain't A Hobby, It's A Lifestyle

  4. #3
    Where Am I ?
    My Bike(s)
    1975 Suzuki TS185
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    38
    It hasn't come yet, nothing has changed on the bike at the moment which is why it worried me so much.

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  6. #4
    Seat Tester
    My Bike(s)
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    Got it, please disregard. I need to defer to those experienced with 2-strokes to help you with the original question. (On the older Triumphs, if it ain't leaking, it's out of oil. LOL!)
    Riding Ain't A Hobby, It's A Lifestyle

  7. #5
    Where Am I ?
    My Bike(s)
    1975 Suzuki TS185
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    38
    No worries! I'll definitely keep that in mind about the exhaust after the muffler is put on.

  8. #6
    M-J Lifetime Achievement Award
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    The oil pump has a lever attached to a secondary cable from the throttle... As the throttle opens the lever is moved to allow more oil to enter the fuel via a pipe fitted to the inlet manifold. Possible faults may be the oil pump is clogged up...there will be a filter mesh somewhere inside the pump. Also check the galleries for debris and the line for leaks....esp at the banjo fitting.

    Another possible problem may be the pump needs priming...you need to fill the engine feed line with oil before you re-attach the pump and somewhere on the pump body will be a bleed point...a bolt near the feed from the oil tank will be likely. This will need to be opened slightly till oil runs out.

    Even with a fully baffled exhaust a two stroke will emit white smoke...this is normal and without it you should suspect the oil delivery system...whhether it is via oil pump or pre-mix...although with the latter you would have mixed the oil in yourself presumably.

    Good luck
    Last edited by Aussie Steve; 11-01-2018 at 01:43 AM.
    Smoke me a kipper I'll be home in time for breakfast

  9. #7
    Where Am I ?
    My Bike(s)
    1975 Suzuki TS185
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    38
    Okay, so I might take it apart and clean it/change the filter. But I really want to test it to make sure that it's broken before I take it apart.
    Don't get me wrong though I totally appreciate those tips, if the thing isn't pushing oil I'll use very bit of that info when I'm diagnosing the problem!
    But I want to just do a sanity check first hahaha how do you think I could do that?
    Last edited by diericx; 11-02-2018 at 12:49 PM.

  10. #8
    Where Am I ?
    My Bike(s)
    1975 Suzuki TS185
    Location
    Denver, CO
    Posts
    38
    I think I pinpointed where the issue is! Here's where (I believe) the line that's shown above continues.

    https://imgur.com/a/fczJEcR

    It runs left, up then into the engine here:

    https://imgur.com/a/CzWoITU

    But as you can see, there's no oil in those tubes! So I'm thinking it must be some kind of clog where the first image is pointing at... that or the mechanism to send oil down the line just isn't working. I'll have to take it apart and look.

    @Aussie are these the engine feed lines you were talking about?

    I won't be able to do that for a while though, is it bad if I premix with the pump still on, knowing the engine isn't getting oil??

    Edit: Just mixed oil in and the smoke is back, thankfully! It was definitely not getting oil.
    Last edited by diericx; 11-02-2018 at 02:32 PM.

  11. #9
    M-J Lifetime Achievement Award
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    Technically you can premix oil and it should be OK. The line shown in the second pic is the oil feed to the reed valves then to the motor via the fuel mix.

    Someone erroniously said that an engine with two feed lines has one going to the bottom end of the motor which I believe is wrong... two strokes get their oiling via the fuel mix...if there are two feed lines then the other will be for a second cylinder...as in a twin.

    The large line in the first picture will probably be the feed from the oil tank to the pump. You did make sure there was oil in the tank? Also there will be a filter in the tank....at the low point but above the feed out line this should be cleaned. Also make sure the little hole in the tank cap is clear...a vacuum here will stop oil getting to the pump.

    The test for the pump is fairly simple but requires it to be removed from the engine.

    A shaft with a flat cutaway is commonly used on the pump drive side and a drill in a vise can be used to turn the shaft. Using a cordless drill flat screwdriver bit hold the pump ...have a remote oil feed....a plastic bottle with a line into it via the cap will do and spin the pump up...it should feed oil to the line...you may have to prime it to remove any air. If this test fails then its time to pull the pump apart for a look see.

    Make sure the pump is primed before ripping into it...most if not all pumps will not pump air...there should be a bolt near the feed in line to bleed any air out of the system...open it partially and pour oil into the feed in or feed out line till it comes out of the bleed point. Once oil is in the pump it shoud draw the oil from the feed line....make sure that is full of oil and not air...hahaha.

    Good luck
    Smoke me a kipper I'll be home in time for breakfast

  12. #10
    Super Moderator

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aussie Steve View Post
    . two strokes get their oiling via the fuel mix...
    Not universally true.

    Right before that designed became an orphan because of environmental concerns, some of the later models DID lube the crank directly.

    IIRC, that allowed you to put less oil in the fuel but the excess crank oil dripped out on the ground. Maybe not much of an improvement.

    It made the whole design somewhat more complicated and I doubt that any are made that way anymore.......but in Europe and Asia, maybe so.

    AND.....I have been a bit reluctant to say this but maybe now is the time:

    Less smoke from a 2 stroke isn't necessarily bad. It can indicate that the rings are sealing better and you are not getting excessive oil in with the fuel and that the plugs aren't fouling out.

    Some of the better 2 strokes showed little to no smoke after they warmed up.
    Don't believe everything that you think.

  13. #11
    M-J Lifetime Achievement Award
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    All my two stoke garden tools...edger, chainsaw, blower etc use oil mix and dont blow too much smoke. A lot of problems occure when too much oil is used in the belief that too much is better than too little. Typically a mix of 40 to 1 will need a teaspoon of oil to the average fuel tank amount....on the average garden too tank edgers etc...not a motorcyclce This is another thing about modern 2 strokes the mix used to be around 25 to 1 now its usually a much higher fuel to oil ratio.
    Last edited by Aussie Steve; 11-06-2018 at 08:54 PM.
    Smoke me a kipper I'll be home in time for breakfast

  14. #12
    Seat Tester
    Posts
    59
    hi you need to check the cables to the pump & make sure that it is set per factory adjustments it works with the throttle control.

  15. #13
    M-J Lifetime Achievement Award
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    WHS^ there should be a mark on the pump output control lever that should line up with a mark on the pump body at full throttle.
    Smoke me a kipper I'll be home in time for breakfast


 

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